East Indian vs Madagascar Rosewood - Differences
#1
I  have read articles where luthiers have said the main sound differrences between instruments results from construction differences rather than type of wood.  They also wrote that the back and sides of guitar do not affect sound as much as the top of the guitar.  Do average players detect much difference in sound between these 2 types of wood ?

I made a deposit 4 or 5 months ago on a E20D MR TC.  I don't think I will ever do something like that again.  I have several guitars but none are rosewood guitars.  I have been waiting 4 or 5 months for a guitar.  Maybe I should just go out an buy a E20D TC or an E40D.
#2
Hi Richard - can I ask when your Eastman E20D MR TC is due? I hope you are happy with it - a number of recipients around here seem very pleased with their MR guitars. whilst others are still weighing things up. Do let us know how it pans out for you. As for the sound board being the significant factor determining sound, well yes - no doubt IMO. And judging by many EGF members' comments, the specific build and choice of back and sides wood can both make a difference too.
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Alan
''Bad company done got me here …'' - Rev Gary Davis
#3
I am one who believes that the overall construction of a guitar (body size, scale length, bracing pattern, wood thickness) make even more difference in tone than tonewoods. The top wood is probably the next largest factor along with the finish; back and sides wood adding more of the "color" of the tone than perceived quality.

I think the difference between Indian rosewood and Madagascar rosewood as cooking two different meals with all the same ingredients but using different spices. An Eastman rosewood dread is still going to sound like an Eastman rosewood dread no matter if it's using Indian or Madi.

Indian and Madagascar will sound a little different (Madi seems to have some more mahogany midrange and presence) but don't expect a massive increase or difference in tone between the two.

The largest difference I have heard on and Eastman rosewood dread was with the varnish finish of my E20SSV. Something about these models makes them much more resonant and vintage sounding than any other Eastman I have owned. The Adi top of my E20SSV also seems much thinner than my older E20D-TC.

These are just my opinions from about two decades of guitar playing and a decade of owning about a dozen Eastmans.
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#4
I can only speak in comparison between an E40OM and one OM MR version I tried. I thought the OM MR would be like my 40 only even more so. It wasn’t. I think what Josh wrote is dead on from my limited experience. The build and the top have more impact on the over-all tone than the back and sides. Ted at LAG described it to my as the MR might add some little nuances compared to the IER, but the differences are not going to be dramatic.
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Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans. John Lennon

Current stable - prone to frequent changes
#5
Agreed--maker voicing, top wood, finish, then back and sides in that order.
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#6
I think the player has a huge impact on tone as well Big Grin
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2020 Eastman E8OM-TC
2023 Eastman E2D
#7
Like Tom, I was expecting the MR TC to be like my EIR guitars (but with a little extra of everything).  And they are not, at least not the dread.  It has the stronger mid-range Mahogany-like presence that Joshua describes.  I growing to like the E20D-MR-TC voice, as it is starting to open up a little more, but it's definitely not what I was expecting.  I don't have any other MR experience, so I don't know if another E20D-MR-TC would sound the same as this one or not.

I also bought the E20OM-MR-TC, and that guitar is much more closely aligned with my two Rosewood/Adi OMs (and as a result, more closely aligned with my expectations).  I'm not sure I got anything more out of that guitar than I would if I bought an E20OM-TC with EIR back and side.  

Again, to Joshua's points, I think EIR and MR are shades of the same color.  There's more mid-range and perhaps more reflective / reverb-like in the MR, but these are nuances and not massively different to me.  Aesthetically, MR is more interesting than EIR, so all things being equal, the MR has that going for it.

Finally, I don't think it's fair to make comparisons (yet!) to my other dreads, which have had 1-7yrs of playing time and opened up a lot.  The E20D-MR-TC seems tight, and that low E string just doesn't seem quite there, which may or may not change over time.  I am trying to be patient, as I remember my 2017 E40D being similar (and now it's a bottom end beast) and my 2017 E20OM-SB being really tight, where the top end was being restricted for the first two years.  I'm three months in and hearing some changes, so I need to give it more time to evolve.
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"It's only castles burning." -- Neil Young
#8
Here's a comparison video we did with the E20D, E20D-MR-TC, and The Bourgeois Touchstone Vintage. There is definitely a difference. In my opinion Madi has a tighter low end with more protection and definition. Indian has a Beefier more muddled low end. Again my opinion.

https://youtu.be/jY7mS5We_bc

BTW. We also just released a video yesterday called is Madagascar Rosewood really worth all the hype. We compared 5 different dreads with Madi from different manufacturers. You might find it interesting.

John
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#9
There are so many factors in the differences of tone due to construction, design, top wood choices (which is most important) it's really hard to be sure of specifics. I agree, back and side woods flavor the tone somewhat.  It's kinda like the difference between moon spruce, adi, european and engleman spruces.  Sometimes it's hype, but mostly the example of the "particular piece of wood and how the guitar is put together" that makes the biggest differences.  I say this because I live down the road from Dream Guitars and I get to play hundreds of woods and designs from allot of small builders and many vintage examples there over many years. There is just so much to differentiate even small nuances of tone qualities.  There are even degree's of greatness, volume, sensitivity, projection, definition, brilliance, resonance...on and on. I believe that specific pieces of wood have very much to do with how great the tone is, even if the guitars are built the same, from the same builder, using different tree's of like woods that will and can change the sound of an acoustic, either manufactured or from a one off boutique builders.

I'm sure many of you have A/B'ed like models from what I call factory builds and hearing that one that just stood out better...of course there is some subjectivity in what humans hear, but not much for musicians ears to discern.

I like to watch this guy, he's got some thoughts on wood qualities! 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dBZRxGnviQ&t=1416s
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